Painting

[lee grout]

I had a dash insert that i painted like I've done a million times before and that cracked to within an inch of its life! Tried to sand back multiple times but to no avail. I ended up throwing it out and getting another. Make sure its spotlessly clean with a suitable surface cleaner/panel wipe. That'll get rid of all contaminants to (hopefully) achieve a good finish. It could be its a contaminated surface rather than a heat issue, Mine was anyway, just sumit to think about.

[demented]

You say you used the Halfords Primer and sprayed over with Paints 4 U paint ?

 

It's my believe that Halfords rattle can paint, (which is actually quite good regardless of what everyone may say), is an Acrylic based paint and it may not be compatible with the Paints 4 U paint.

 

The rattle cans from Paints 4 U will more than likely be a solvent based paint, I'm unsure whether the two types of paint; Acrylic and Solvent, can be used together ?

 

To ensure my rattle can paint was compatible with the lacquer I intended to use, I asked my paint suppler what type of paint was inside the rattle cans, he stated it was was pre mixed 2 pac (2k).

 

I normally buy my primer from same place I buy the paint.

 

I can't be certain, but I'm sure I have used the Halfords primer in the past with solvent based rattle can paint, without adverse effects ?

 

You'll be able to find a compatible primer, Paints 4 u will be able to supply one if need be.

 

I user a filler primer, which I believe is also referred to, as a high build primer.

 

It's best to ask your supplier which type  of paint is in the rattle cans and also in the future, buy all primer, paints and lacquer from the one supplier to ensure there compatible with each other.

 

When the cracking appeared on my door, initially I flatted the area and cracks, applied stopper paste, primed painted and lacquered, ensuring each coat flashed off, yet the cracked reappeared in the same area but different cracks in different places.

 

I had no choice but to completely remove all the cracked paint, stopper and lacquer, going right back to the cars original paint and start again.

 

Don't worry so much with regard to the paint flashing off.

Inside a unheated garage with current UK temp, 10-15 mins flash off time is sufficient.

just touch an area of masking tape which has been covered in overspray of a similar paint depth to the item being painted, if dry enough to touch without smearing but remaining tacky/sticky, then ready for next coat.

 

Ideally you want to apply coats one after another to gradually build up one thick coat, applying a dust coat first, followed by two heavier coats.

The paint is applied in layers to prevent sags or runs, especially on contours, but leaving 20 mins or more in between coats won't have any adverse effect, especially on the type of components you are painting.

 

I wouldn't be too concern on drying in a heated room either, it wont do any arm, I've dry painted panels with heat lamps and hair dryers in the past to speed up the process, but always allow to flash off first.

My only concern would be the absorption of Carbon monoxide into the paint if a gas fire or boiler was in use near by in a confined area, I don't even know if absorption is possible, it was only a suggestion in an attempt to rule out a possible cause to the paint cracking.

 

However, on one occasion when blending in Red paint, using T Cut Colour Restorer, my newly applied paint seemed to appear lighter than it did prior to using the T Cut.

 

It stuck out, like a sore thumb!

 

Turns out, the ammonia in the T Cut was affecting the paint.

 

Same did not occur when using Halfords rubbing compound or Farecla.

 

I don't use T Cut to blend in now.

 

If the rear lock trim is made of the greyish textured Plastic, it's possible that it may of dried out over time and someone has used Back to Black on it or WD40 to restore its colour.

It may of also absorbed years and years of polish.

 

Polish and Back to Black or any other trim restorer tends to leave traces of silicone behind.

 

Silicone contamination of paint, normally appears like fish eyes in the paint.

 

Paint applied to a surface contaminated by WD40 will totally fcuks up the new paint. I've never seen its effect but it's use is actually forbidden in many paint and body shops.

 

When painting textured plastic trim, I believe it's advisable to prime using a special plastic sealer, which apparently prevent paint reacting to the oils in the plastic and also assist with paint adhesion, once sealer been applied, prime and paint as normal.

[Rockerrob666]

cheers.

 

reading through, lightning hit my brain. when i bought the car in august, the salesman had smothered the whole car in polish, even the interior, to make it look shiney, it took me weeks to clean off the steering wheel. the grill is off another car, so it wouldn't have been polished, that would be why i had no probs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't thank you enough, where i did san and prep the plastic before painting, I obviousley didn't take into account the impregnated polish. Gonna hunt for the plastic sealer, strip all the paint off, give the plastic a bath in white spirit, then soap off, meth wipe, then try the plastic sealer with high build primer. gonna go all out on this one!

 

lets give that a try and I'll let you know how it comes out.

 

Had the boiler serviced last week, thats clean! hehe, not to worry, the only fumes I'm getting toasted on is paint!

[Stu]

Chances are the dealer covered the interior with silicone.. paint's worst nightmare. Get some panel wipe. Edited November 15, 2012 by Stu

[demented]

Like Stu says, just wipe thoroughly with panel wipes or thinners.

 

I actually use two forms of liquid panel detergent, one to remove water based contaminates and another to remove silicone/solvent based contaminates, then I wipe dry with paper towel, the blue stuff seen at garage forecourts, can also use kitchen towel.

 

Silicone, contamination will leave a fish eye effect in the paint, like sunken craters/dimples/fish eyes

 

If I remember, the grill is a diffetent texure and of a harder kind of plastic to that of the rear lock/handle trim, which its softer, slighty rubbery with more texture.

 

I believe this type of plastic can't be flatted down, it just requires cleaning, wiped quickly with cloth n thinners or a panel wipe, dried and then apply plastic sealer primer and paint.

 

Although your gas boiler has passed a Gas Safe safety check, the boiler still produces Carbon monoxide and if the boiler is located in a confined space, there is a good possibly that the safe level of carbon monoxide produced could be absorbed into any freshly painted item stored there. 

I only say this due to my experience with the ammonia in the T Cut.

 

It's worth considering, there is nothing more annoying than to start all over again, follow all advice and steps given, then dry painted item in the laundry room, only to discover the cracks have reappeared, 

 

And drying in the laundry room, being the only step that remained the same.

[Rockerrob666]

ah, the laundry room isn't the only constant, as the last attempt, I left the trim in the garage when I popped out to pick the kids up from school, and the splitting repeated its' self., your right it's bloody frustrating to repain three times now and to have the cracking everytime. the only constant it seems, is the paint.

 

up to now, all I have been doing is sanding back past the cracks to achieve a smooth finish where I can apply further base coat (as some areas are taken back to the undercoat) each time I achieve a very smooth finish, but the results have all been the same.

 

I believe that the cause of the problems has been the silicone polish that the garage smothered the car in when they valeted it for the forecourt. Although I thoroughly washed the trim in both soapy water and meth before I painted, this may not have removed all the contamination from the silicone polish. I have purchased a can of 'Bumper Preperation' from halfords - 'removes all residues of silicones, grease and wax prior to painting pumpers or other plastics'.

 

After using paint stripper and white spirit to remove all existing paint and resand to smooth finish (the boot lock trim easily smoothed down using 240 grit, the textured plastic came off quite easily with a bit of elbow grease - I have kept the texture in the resesses to give grip when lifting the tailgate). I gave it another wash in soapy water and a wipe over with the Bumper prep, already i can see a difference, the way the water / liquid dries and evaporates off the plastic is completely different charateristics to the way it did before. before is quite quickly ran off the trim (like a polished car!!!) now it's quite slow in drying with very little runoff of surface water. you can instantly tell that the surface is different!! i do believe we may have ...... ah was gonna say 'cracked it' but found the culprit.

 

gonna attack it tomorrow afternoon, uninterupted and apply the coats as directed above. will post results tomorrow evening. fingers crossed or I'm gonna scream - if you hear a blood curdlin scream about tea time tomorrow - you'll know what's happened! (doesn't matter where you are in the country, you'll hear it! if it works, everyone too portsmouth, the drinks are on me

[Rockerrob666]

heya everyone, IT IS DONE!!!!! having probs with photobucket atm, but will get pics up as soon as poss. I ended up using the Halfords Panther Black and with the finer spray got a perfect finish, first time!! yay. I think part of it was down to the nozel on the Paints4U cans. it was so heavy and clumpy the coats where too thick, would explain the cracking, where it was trying to slide off!

 

gonna see if I can put some new nozzles on the p4u cans and try and save the paint, can't afford to lose that amount of paint.

 

thanks eeveryone for you help and suggestions.

[demented]

Hey, pleased its completed, be good to see photos, been thinking of doing same to mine.

 

If the paint appear too heavy, increase the distance between rattle can and the item/area you are spraying and or increase speed of pass over (side to side movement).

 

Suppliers such as Paints 4u, normally supply rattle cans with what is referred to as a Professional spray nozzle, which has a far superior and wider spray fan to that of a more tradition rattle can, claimed to be similar to that of a Professional air gun, which in my opinion, its quite good, however, it does produce a much heavier application of paint.

 

Whatever's being sprayed, whether sealer, primer or base coat, (except lacquer) it's best to spray at a distance to create a dust coat first, which as the name suggest, gives the appearance of speckled overspray like effect (dust), this is achieved by increasing the distance between the item/area being painted and the air gun/rattle can.

 

Once flashed off, apply next coat but slightly heavier, do so by moving the air gun/rattle can closer.

 

With a little practice, it's possible to compromise speed and distance when applying the paint, the closer the air gun/rattle can is to the item/area being painted, the quicker the pass over, however, it's not good to get too close.

 

Normally, 10 inches (25cm) is a good distance, which will enable a smooth and natural hand speed (pass over)

[Rockerrob666]

Hey, pleased its completed, be good to see photos, been thinking of doing same to mine.

 

If the paint appear too heavy, increase the distance between rattle can and the item/area you are spraying and or increase speed of pass over (side to side movement).

 

Suppliers such as Paints 4u, normally supply rattle cans with what is referred to as a Professional spray nozzle, which has a far superior and wider spray fan to that of a more tradition rattle can, claimed to be similar to that of a Professional air gun, which in my opinion, its quite good, however, it does produce a much heavier application of paint.

 

Whatever's being sprayed, whether sealer, primer or base coat, (except lacquer) it's best to spray at a distance to create a dust coat first, which as the name suggest, gives the appearance of speckled overspray like effect (dust), this is achieved by increasing the distance between the item/area being painted and the air gun/rattle can.

 

Once flashed off, apply next coat but slightly heavier, do so by moving the air gun/rattle can closer.

 

With a little practice, it's possible to compromise speed and distance when applying the paint, the closer the air gun/rattle can is to the item/area being painted, the quicker the pass over, however, it's not good to get too close.

 

Normally, 10 inches (25cm) is a good distance, which will enable a smooth and natural hand speed (pass over)

hi,

 

it's wierd. I've painted a million things in my time, but always with halfords or other similar speck paint with quite a fine spray. I will be honest and this was the first time with what they call a 'proffessional spray nozzle' i though it was bloody horrible. I can get a far better finish with the standard nozzle - makes you wonder why it's like that.

 

I laways spray from about 25cm 30cm for the first coat or so and slowley biuld up thin coats, so I'm used to 'dusting' it, bit this was so heavy and gloopy - I'll stick the cheap stuff, it's a lot better haha. have found some nozzles from wilkinsons cans that fit the paint4u cans and spray is now finer and smoother. somethings backwards somewhere if you ask me!!

 

cheers for the help dude, will buy you a pint sometime and if theres any help I can offer anyone, just ask.

[demented]

Cheers!

 

When experimenting from scratch, we all develop our own techniques.

 

With every rattle can, my paint supplier always provides 3 coloured nozzles, white, red and black, so I assume there's some kind of nozzle colour coding, as each nozzle appears to provide a different mist of paint.

 

I must admit, I like the Halfords off the shelf rattle cans too, although I always opt for the 'Professional type' cans now, initially due to the mixing of the colours, being a much closer match to existing colours but now, because I prefer the paint delivery and finish of the Professional type nozzle.

 

I guess it's what you get use to.

[Rockerrob666]

right, Photobucket is now working:

 

the boot trim after being filled and smoothed:

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00176-20121112-1858-1.jpg

 

after undercoat:

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00193-20121117-1820.jpg

 

after laquer:

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00195-20121117-2044.jpg

 

and now, for it's public debut, a pre-release before being fitted, the front upper grill:

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00192-20121115-2342.jpg

 

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00191-20121115-2340.jpg

 

I don't think the pictures do the grill justice, but just giving the laquer time to harden before putting it on the car, which will prob be next weekend

 

cheers guys for all the guidance and suggestions and ideas, would have got a lot more stressed without you.

 

[demented]

Hey, finish is looking very good.

[Rockerrob666]

Hey, finish is looking very good.

why thank you, i'll admit there are a few very minor blemishes, but nothing you can see unless you really looking for them. I'm happy and I ended up using a bycicle tyre repair rubber patch to cover the whole left by the boot lock.

 

came out really well I think

 

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00196-20121120-1324.jpg

 

http://i1339.photobucket.com/albums/o720/rockerrob666/Project%20Satan/IMG00197-20121120-1351.jpg