HIGHTOWER Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Love this thread so far! Can't wait to see further updates on it! Have I ready right that this will be running 4wd? I've heard people question the strength of the transfer box, do you think it was be a cause for concern? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksofstichill Posted January 24, 2013 Author Share Posted January 24, 2013 Thanks, glad you're liking how it's looking so far! Yes, the car it's going to be fitted in is an RS2000 4x4, David bought a Donor 2.0 complete with gearbox and transfer box as well as the donor 2.3 so I can build up as complete a unit as possible here to minimise the amount of parts needing changed over when its being fitted to the car. Another update, New Piston Rings - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0158.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0159.jpg Fitted them to the pistons - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0160.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0161.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0162.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0163.jpg Pistons 1 & 4 fitted into the block - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0164.jpg New Big End Bearing Shells - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0165.jpg Shells Fitted - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0166.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0167.jpg Big End Caps fitted but not torqued up as ARP bolts will be fitted once they arrive - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0168.jpg Pistons 2 & 3 Fitted - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0169.jpg Shells fitted - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0170.jpg Big End Caps fitted - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0171.jpg All Pistons & Rods now fitted with end caps tightened but not torqued as ARP bolts still to be fitted - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0172.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0173.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0174.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0175.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0176.jpg Just forgot to add there, although the transfer boxes can fail it's often just down to abuse or poor maintenance, as long as it is in good condition to start with and is ran with plenty of oil it will handle the additional power without any trouble, excessively hard launches, drifting and donuts are the common transfer box killers so as long as it's driven with some mechanical sympathy I reckon it won't give any bother.....fingers crossed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hicksy Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Im loving this build!! Its making me want to keep my RS and build the spare engine i have up into a 2.3 or similar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted January 25, 2013 Share Posted January 25, 2013 It's nice that someone is doing it properly for once. What kind of piston-to-bore and main/big end clearances are you getting with the used parts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksofstichill Posted January 27, 2013 Author Share Posted January 27, 2013 Im loving this build!! Its making me want to keep my RS and build the spare engine i have up into a 2.3 or similar Thanks, glad you're liking it so far! What's your RS you have just now? Mk5,Mk6,4x4,2wd? It's nice that someone is doing it properly for once. What kind of piston-to-bore and main/big end clearances are you getting with the used parts? Thanks Stu, I think a lot of the 2.3 conversions in particular are "thrown together" rather than stripped and rebuilt properly so hopefully I'm doing a nice job on this one! The Crankshaft was perfect, virtually no wear at all so the clearance was bang-on on that. As you'll know, if there's really any crank wear at all you're looking at a regrind. Piston to bore clearance is still within tolerance but obviously with honing the bores to clean them up you do increase it ever so slightly. If the bores hadn't been really good on this one we'd have had to source another block or seriously look into a rebore and new pistons, then the dilemna is whether you fit forged pistons when you're at that stage and the cost spirals! Another bit of an update on this along with some basic tech spec figures for this engine - Bore - 89.6mm (standard 2.3) Stroke - 86.0mm (standard 2.0) Capacity - 2169cc Compression Ratio - 8.72:1 Onto the Cylinder Head now, Tappets removed - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0177.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0178.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0179.jpg Valve Spring compressed to remove collets - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0180.jpg Removing Collets - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0181.jpg Valve Spring and Spring Cap removed - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0182.jpg All Valves removed - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0183.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0184.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0185.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0186.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0187.jpg Inlet Valves aren't in bad condition - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0188.jpg Exhaust Valves look to have some pitting but it's hard to see until they are cleaned up - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0189.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0190.jpg Valve Stem Oil Seals removed - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0191.jpg Spring Seats removed - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0192.jpg With the head down to a bare casting it was all degreased and the ports and chambers were given a good decoke and clean up - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0193.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0194.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0195.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0196.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0197.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0198.jpg Head onto the milling machine to be skimmed - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0199.jpg Skimmed by the minimum amount required to clean up the face - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0200.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0201.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orionzetec Posted January 27, 2013 Share Posted January 27, 2013 Fantastic work Will be keeping my eye on this one. What primer did you use BTW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidrick Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Do you mind me asking how much you charge for your part in this build? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksofstichill Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 Fantastic work Will be keeping my eye on this one. What primer did you use BTW? Thanks, much appreciated! The engine block was sprayed with a Red Oxide Enamel Primer and then with a Gloss Red Enamel, they were both Halfords products supplied by the customer and seemed to work well. A lot of engine enamels don't use a primer though, they're just applied straight onto the block. Do you mind me asking how much you charge for your part in this build? No, I don't mind at all, no problems. This particular build was a lot more extensive than just building a bare engine as you'll see later on in the thread once I get some more updates on here, however the cost to build up to a bare engine stage would be roughly as follows: Starting with the 2 donor engines supplied by the customer and with the customer supplying any parts required, or me supplying the parts at additional cost it would be around £650 plus VAT for labour to strip both engines, carry out all the refurbishment work and rebuild one engine back to the bare stage, i.e. rocker cover and sump back on but no manifolds or ancilliaries. That includes cleaning and painting of the block, head (if required), sump and rocker cover. You'll see as the thread goes on that the way I can refurbish the head for example means that the existing valves can be re-used rather than replaced so in most cases the parts required can be kept to a minimum without compromising the quality of the job. If it was purely a 2.0 engine to rebuild using only one engine as a donor then the cost would be approximately £500 plus VAT in labour to do the same job. The same type of build could be carried out but using forged pistons and rods, uprated cams, etc, etc and the labour cost would in many cases actually go down as less time would be spent cleaning pistons and fitting rings for example. In the case of an engine requiring a rebore I can also carry out that work in house which again keeps costs and downtime to a minimum. If you've got any other questions about it please just ask and I'll be happy to help. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 That's pretty cheap if it includes rebuilding the head! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksofstichill Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 Thanks Stu, yes that does include rebuilding the head, it's basically the complete job from dropping off 2 donor engines to picking up one at the end with all the work required in between, if it needed a rebore it would be additional to that but it's only £80 for that and since I can do it here there's no messing about transporting it elsewhere to be done and then having to pick it up again, etc. I always take photos at every stage so you can see the work that's been done and to go along with the history of the car it's being fitted to, cheers! Some more updates, One final clean up and the head is set aside ready to be rebuilt - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0202.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0203.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0204.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0205.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0206.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0207.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0208.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0209.jpg all of the valves as removed from the head - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0210.jpg Exhaust Valves - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0211.jpg Inlet Valves - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0212.jpg Inlet Valves cleaned up with the wire brush on the bench grinder - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0213.jpg Exhaust Valves cleaned up with the wire brush and the pitting of the seating face is much more noticeable - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0214.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0215.jpg Inlet Valves onto the lathe to be polished - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0216.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0217.jpg Inlet Valves polished up - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0218.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0219.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0220.jpg Exhaust Valves onto the lathe - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0221.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0222.jpg Polished Up - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0223.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0224.jpg Since they've been polished the pitting is even more noticeable. Fitting the valves when they're like that is a waste of time, unless they're heavily ground in with rough grinding paste you'll never get a good seal on the valve seat and doing that's never going to make a good job of it. http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0225.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidrick Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Sounds like a bargain at that price! Do you run your own company (I ask because you mention VAT in the prices) or is this a spare-time thing you do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksofstichill Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 Cheers! You'd be surprised how many people think that's actually expensive! Yes, I do run my own business thanks hence the dreaded VAT, I've always done work at home in my own workshop at nights/weekends, etc but I officially started in Business part time in 2005 and went full time in 2008. I just work myself but do almost everything in-house, the engine side of things is only part of what I do but it's become much busier on that side of things in the past year or so. To make all the seating faces of all the valves "as new" it's onto the Valve Refacer, using this means I can refurbsh the valves rather than them having to be replaced - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0226.jpg Inlet Valve onto the refacer - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0227.jpg Face Reground - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0228.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0229.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0230.jpg All Inlet valves refaced - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0231.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0232.jpg Exhaust Valve onto the refacer - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0233.jpg Face reground - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0234.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0235.jpg You can see the difference it makes most to the exhaust valves, the faces were pitted and rough before but now the faces are smooth and perfectly concentric to the valve stem so it'll give an excellent seal to the valve seat once it's lapped in, that's all the exhaust valves done - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0236.jpg http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0237.jpg Some fine paste on the valves ready to lep them into the valve seats. If the Valve seats had been rough or damaged I'd have re-cut them but they were on really good order so this work wasn't required - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0238.jpg First Valve being lapped in - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0239.jpg It's hard to see in the photo but the inlet valve seat (on the left) now has a smooth dulled finish with a "band" showing all around it which shows that the valve is sealing all the way around it - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0240.jpg Halfway there! http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0241.jpg Last one - http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0242.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahmotorsport Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 http://blackengineering.co.uk/images/David-Newman-2.2-Turbo-RS2000-Engine/0226.jpg Corr! We got exactly the same one as that. Great work so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksofstichill Posted January 28, 2013 Author Share Posted January 28, 2013 Cheers! Yes, the Valve Grinder is a classic but they still do a good job today eh? Loads of them got scrapped at local garages years ago, think I have about 4 in total! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIGHTOWER Posted January 28, 2013 Share Posted January 28, 2013 Halfway there! Livin' on a prayer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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